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Author Topic: William Clarke Chromatic Blues  (Read 8121 times)

rnav2174

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William Clarke Chromatic Blues
« on: December 12, 2013, 05:14:23 PM »
Forget this conversation.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2013, 07:24:21 PM by rnav2174 »

Naptown Blue

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Re: William Clarke Chromatic Blues
« Reply #1 on: December 13, 2013, 09:47:45 AM »
While chromatic blues is fine and dandy, i dont think anyone on here would have said otherwise, the diatonic is where the blues is played.  In some west coast swing and some types of chicago blues, chromatic is irreplaceable, carey bell comes to mind and clarke. Rod piazza blows a mean chromatic in the west coast style.

I dont think anyone of those guys on Beale would agree that it would take them to another level.  Last time i was there adam gussow was playing with richard johnston, and a diatonic was on full display



HarpMitch

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Re: William Clarke Chromatic Blues
« Reply #2 on: December 14, 2013, 12:22:14 PM »
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bp8YBGaXJLI

Well I can say: "That's Blues on chromatic and diatonic and I get the most bluesy Feelings.......Rod Piazza one of the best. ..... 8)

With bluesy regards

Mitch

Beelzebob

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Re: William Clarke Chromatic Blues
« Reply #3 on: December 14, 2013, 01:43:10 PM »
Most of us here love chromatic blues, Paul DeLay is another good one.  George Smith is the granddaddy.  Of course Little Walter played some.  I put a link up to George Smith doing "I Left My Heart in San Francisco," Stan didn't care for it but I was blown away by the soulful technique.  Here it is again:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RpfHvepbRTU


Beelzebob

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Re: William Clarke Chromatic Blues
« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2013, 05:28:29 PM »
Wow, sounded great to me, you guys would be great trading fours. 

Gorfalamu

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Re: William Clarke Chromatic Blues
« Reply #5 on: December 14, 2013, 06:52:11 PM »
The capacity for the chromatic to convey blues lies not with the instrument but with the player.  IMHO, there are no cold chromatics, only cold players.

If you want it blue, you can make it so but not if "true blue" is restricted to one nuance of one voice. 

A while back I recorded this chromatic/diatonic version of St. James Infirmary more or less to prove that point.  The two harps carry on a conversation based on the song's lyrics so it's easy to compare  the voices.  It may not be so easy to tell which is which!

http://soundclick.com/share.cfm?id=6621450


htrain

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Re: William Clarke Chromatic Blues
« Reply #6 on: December 15, 2013, 02:16:20 PM »
@Gorfalamu - loved your take on St James Infirmary, on both harps and couldn't agree more on the question of 'cold players or cold harps'. Now this is from a person who only recently has taken the chrome up in a relatively serious way. George Harmonica Smith, William Clarke and Rod Piazza (Dennis Gruenling too) are regular plays on my iTunes list and are getting regular attention and study!!

Your playing is not too shabby either!!!

Gorfalamu

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Re: William Clarke Chromatic Blues
« Reply #7 on: December 18, 2013, 01:25:33 AM »
@htrain  Thanks, I'm glad you enjoyed it. I posted it a few years back here on HB.  Do anthing and everything you can on a chromatic--it just gets better.  And don't buy off on that crap that you can do it all on a C harp.  I have five different keys and they all get used.
@nav  You are a very talented player but you aren't playing blues.  It's not how often you use the slide, it's how well and you have that down pat for your style.  But it's not blues.  Learn to play Stormy Monday in first position; I highly recommend the revised version with the jazz turn around.  That's where your playing has to be on the button.

Cheers,
Gorf

Eric Stahl

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Re: William Clarke Chromatic Blues
« Reply #8 on: December 18, 2013, 04:04:42 PM »
rnav, I agree with Gorf - that you're a talented player, and "It's not how often you use the slide, it's how well and you have that down pat for your style."

There's no getting around the right notes in the right places, at any speed or with any technique.

-Eric

Gorfalamu

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Re: William Clarke Chromatic Blues
« Reply #9 on: December 19, 2013, 03:56:30 PM »
"Gorf, read closer, you must have missed this. One of the first things I wrote, was that the piece wasn't a Blues piece."

Disclaimer noted but you compared your playing style to a blues player's method to demonstrate that blues players don't use the slide enough and/or not as much as you.  Different worlds, different music, different arrangements.  IMHO, false comparison.

"...most players who use a Chrom for Blues just sound like Diatonic players because they play it like a Diatonic player..."

Point of entry for many crossover diatonic players into the world of chromatic is often third position minor key and they will naturally follow familiar lines.   How far the sound departs from diatonic playing is up to the skill and style of the player and, most importantly, what the music requires.

Not everyone is or will be a chromatic master.  And there is much, much more to skilled chromatic playing than button pushing in third position.   I'd recommend checking out the zillions of tab arrangements available at slidemeister.org for a real workout on chromatic playing.  Try any piece in A or E on a C chromatic, for instance.

Personally, I would rather encourage players to engage the chromatic in any way possible that feels and sounds good rather than disparage their playing because they don't do it "my way."

Just sayin...

Gorf

Naptown Blue

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Re: William Clarke Chromatic Blues
« Reply #10 on: December 19, 2013, 05:02:09 PM »
I think a huge tongue blocked octave sliding up the chromatic sounds more bluesy in its classic simplicity than a bunch of diddling runs and button pushing.

Eric Stahl

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Re: William Clarke Chromatic Blues
« Reply #11 on: December 19, 2013, 10:39:09 PM »
You should play what sounds right to you, absolutely! You've got a good thing going.

My earlier comment wasn't going one way or the other. Just put the right notes in the right places, no matter how you play them  :)

-Eric

rnav2174

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Re: William Clarke Chromatic Blues
« Reply #12 on: December 20, 2013, 07:23:41 PM »
Sorry guys, for wasting everyone's time, forget this conversation. I shouldn't have started it in the first place. Everybody just do what is good for them, music is freedom so play what ever and however you want, I know I will. Thanks for all of your comments and suggestions. Bee, thanks for the bt "One For The Duke" , my style feels comfortable with it, I like it, you turned me on to another genre to concentrate on, that's the one I may post when I get it down. Once again, apologies to all who contributed to the conversation. Although I still feel that playing a Chrom like a Horn player with some diddling runs and button pushing can add something to the Chrom Blues players bag of tricks, it's my thing and if it interest you fine ,if not ,not a problem, carry on with what works for you . Happy Holidays to you all and stay safe so you can continue playing music how ever you want .

B , here's proof that I've at least started on The Duke. Sorry , still playing with some of my own melody stuff. Will go back an do your's note for note, at least to get me started in the right direction.

http://f.cl.ly/items/2n1C2h1C3u0g1d28223p/One%20For%20The%20Duke%20(%20test%2012-20-13%201341%20).mp3

Here's the lower Harp sound, it almost sounds like an old BB horn. Cool.Something to build on .

http://f.cl.ly/items/0x1E143y1k0F1A3K061D/One%20for%20The%20Duke%20(%20lower%20octave%20starting%20on%20C%20).mp3


Blue In Green

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Re: William Clarke Chromatic Blues
« Reply #13 on: December 21, 2013, 09:45:50 AM »
Great playing there. Doesnt' look like this thread has made the clear distinction between playing blues chromatically on a chromatic harmonica vs. playing blues in third position on a chrom. IMO, there is a big difference. In the first case, the player could be using just one C chrom to play in any key; the player uses the chrom as a transposing instrument. In the second case, the player chooses the chrom that matches for third-position blues; for the key of D, that is a C chrom. In this case, the player is working within the framework of third position. This is typical of George Smith and all those players who followed his lead. Clarke and Piazza were direct proteges of Smith. Smith did play some chrom in other positions, but most songs are in third position. Paul DeLay on the other hand had his own thing going on IMO. He played the chrom chromatically, more like a jazz player would. He was awesome too. Players like Toots Yhielemans, Mike Turk (great player here in Boston area), and Stevie Wonder all play chromatically, using the chrom as a transposing instrument for whatever chords they find in a song.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2013, 09:49:34 AM by Blue In Green »

rnav2174

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Re: William Clarke Chromatic Blues
« Reply #14 on: December 21, 2013, 10:38:13 AM »
Thanks Blue, for almost 40 years now Stevie's style has been my main influence in everything I play and now that I'm playing a lot of Smooth Jazz horn licks and runs, my style is a combo of the two. I play everything with a C harp using a CX-12, WH12 or Super 64, it works for me and keeps me going . Thanks again and Happy Holidays.

 

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